We felt for him when his father was murdered as Hanno, when he bravely fought an Unas as Simon, and discovered a true path to ascension as Avrid. Now, actor David McNally joins Dial the Gate LIVE to discuss his experiences during SG-1 and Atlantis, share his live and career, and take your questions.

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Timecodes
0:00 – Splash Screen
00:32 – Opening Credits
00:57 – Welcome and Episode Outline
02:19 – Welcoming David and his early years
05:45 – David on Acting
09:09 – Challenging Roles
13:00 – “Cor-ai”
28:14 – “Demons” Audition and the Stolen Van
31:53 – “Demons”
37:25 – “Epiphany”
46:22 – Fan Questions: Cast Differences
48:21 – Inspirational Actors
51:15 – Theatre Techniques
55:27 – Stage Acting VS TV and Film
56:33 – Moments of Encouragement
1:00:18 – Future Projects
1:00:47 – Walking Through the Stargate
1:01:51 – Downtime Activities
1:03:06 – Wrapping up with David
1:04:12 – Post-Interview Housekeeping
1:07:07 – End Credits

***

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TRANSCRIPT
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David Read
Hello, everyone. Welcome to episode 167 of Dial the Gate. My name is David Read. Thank you so much for tuning in to the Stargate Oral History Project. We’ve got a couple of shows for you today. This first one is live with David McNally who’s played three roles in Stargate SG-1, two in SG-1 and one in Atlantis. Before we really get into it. If you like Stargate and you want to see more content like this on YouTube, it would mean a great deal if you click the Like button. It makes a difference with YouTube’s algorithm and will continue to help the show grow. Please also consider sharing this video with a Stargate friend. I know you have them. And if you want to get notified about future episodes, click the Subscribe icon. And giving the Bell icon a click will notify you the moment a new video drops, and will get my notifications of any last minute guests changes. And clips from this live stream will be released over the course of the next few weeks on the Dial the Gate and GateWorld.net YouTube channels. As this is a live show, I have David with us and we are going to be asking him questions about his life, his career, of course his time on Stargate, so be sure to get those questions that you have for him to our moderators in the YouTube chat. They’ll get them over to me, in the second half of the show, I will get them to David. David McNally, who played Hanno, who played Simon, who played Avrid on Stargate SG-1 and Stargate Atlantis, way back in the day. Sir, this is a pleasure to have you. Thank you so much for being here.

David McNally
Oh, you’re welcome. It’s great for me. I love chatting about the work that we do.

David Read
When did you decide that acting was a thing for you? Were you young? Were you a little bit older? When did this get stuck in your craw and say, “You know what? This fits for me, I like this.”

David McNally
I think like a lot of families, we used to do a thing at my grandparents where after dinner, the kids would have to entertain the adults. And so I somehow, at a very young age, started as the MC. I would get up and introduce everybody and try to tell a knock-knock joke, or something like that. And I think just the joy that it brought everyone and brought myself was kind of the hook. And then I think it was great, too, I played the troll, and you know, the grass is greener on the other side sort of story, I don’t know if you remember that one, and that was good. And then I played like a version of Scrooge, full Jim in grade two at the age of seven. So I was hooked. And throughout my education, it was the one subject I enjoyed. I really didn’t take to other subjects that well. And of course, by the time I got out of high school, I was destined for university drama education to become a drama teacher, and I also went to the National Theatre School of Canada to train as a theater actor. And right out of that I was working, so it was something that’s been a part of my life since a very young age.

David Read
Wow. How long did you teach?

David McNally
I’ve been teaching up until two years ago. I retired, which is great. I’m enjoying it. I do a little bit of subbing from time to time, but it frees up a lot of time to kind of just enjoy my family and enjoy living, because as a drama teacher, it’s all consuming.

David Read
Absolutely.

David McNally
And I did that throughout my career as an actor. So I would, you know, fly into Vancouver and to Toronto, I would do a gig and I’d come home and I’d get right back into classes, and it kept me pretty busy.

David Read
I have taught myself, definitely not drama though. There is something extraordinary about opening doors for people and watching them walk through them and discover a new, best facet of themselves.

David McNally
Yeah. And part of that has been teaching the tech as well. And they’re a different sort of bird, the tech kids. They have different interests, but they really bond well. And their collaboration, in some ways, is stronger than those of the performers.

David Read
You mean the people who are running the show behind the scenes?

David McNally
Yeah, working the lighting, you know, doing the props, doing the costumes, all that stuff. So yeah, it’s filled up all my days as I raised four kids.

David Read
Oh, my gosh.

David McNally
Yeah. All my kids are in their 30s now, living their lives, and I’ve got a granddaughter.

David Read
Oh, how wonderful. If you could do it all over again, what departments would you think you would really have taken to?

David McNally
That’s a tough one. You know, my eldest son is a documentary filmmaker, and he has so much control in terms of his artistic goals. And I think I would aspire towards that, more towards directing, though I have done lots of directing. My other son has worked both as a dolly grip, and as a boom op, and those are interesting, too. I just, I think it’s, you know, for me, it’s been a joy just to be a, kind of, theater worker, because I’ve done a tremendous amount of stage, both backstage and onstage. I enjoy the theater the most, I would say. But it’s hard to say, of the crew positions. I think, you know, the dressers, they’re a fun bunch. The people that go in before everybody, and they make that place look like it should. And so that when actors walk in, it just feels right. You know, I think that’s a great job.

David Read
There’s something so unique about the experience of taking part in a shared mass illusion. You’re all gonna go in there and buy it, or you’re not, you know. I remember watching Avenue Q, which is with Muppets, and the performers are in black, standing right there with the Muppets, and talking, not hiding that their mouths are moving, while they’re moving the puppet. And you have to accept the fact that the people in black are not actually there. And if you allow yourself to do that, it’s very easy to almost forget that they’re actually standing there.

David McNally
Well, it is that suspension of disbelief that Coleridge talks about, and I think that everybody has to buy into it to really get emotionally connected to the story. You have to let go that you’re watching a TV, you know. You have to let go that you’re watching actors, and immerse yourself into the emotions that the performers are conveying, the music is conveying, the story is bringing. And once you do that, then yeah, we’re caught, right? We get caught up to where we’re crying, we’re laughing, we’re angry at somebody, some character that’s doing something on there. And it seems to happen naturally, and it might be something instinctual that, you know, storytelling has been around a long time, so, it’s in our DNA.

David Read
I think it’s an intrinsic part of the human experience. There’s a lot of psychological work being done now that seems to indicate that we view our world in terms of stories. And I don’t know if it’s because we’ve been raised in stories or because like you say, it’s just a part of our DNA. That’s how we manage to filter the world. But there’s definitely a lot going on there. And you know, the best way to relate to someone is through a story.

David McNally
Yeah. And it happens at childhood, right? The first thing you’re doing with your kids is telling them stories. And that’s those lessons and mythology that guide them, hopefully, establish a foundation to guide them through life.

David Read
Is there any particular role that stands out to you as one that was particularly transformative for you as a person? Or one that pushed you in directions that you didn’t anticipate or did anticipate and, “Oh, I got through that. But, man, was that a journey.”

David McNally
Yeah, I think there’s been a few. Mostly it’s the theatrical experience, which for me is a little bit more difficult, in that you don’t get to stop. You got to keep going. And the audience’s reaction is immediate and you have to ride off that reaction. You know, when I got to play the Scot, from Shakespeare, on a major stage here, that was transforming because it pushed my craft to a new level. Just being out there for the full two and a half hours, and ending with a broad sword fight, and all that it took to do nine shows a week was a tremendous challenge, on top of teaching in the morning.

David Read
Oh my God.

David McNally
And then, you know, trying to see your kids and wife at the same time. So that was a big one. But in terms of television, you know, there’s been so many different challenges. I did an independent film here in Edmonton, it was called 1132 Pleasant Street. And just being a lead actor on a feature film, an independent film, demanded a lot of me, personally, just to what I had to sacrifice in order to make that happen. And that type of commitment I think I really grew from and it gave me a lot of confidence in approaching more television and approaching my craft.

David Read
Yeah, they’re not paying you just for your time and your actor skills. They’re paying for your brain bandwidth. We’ve all seen the stories and read the tabloids about how marriages and everything else suffer, you know, when you’ve got people on set for all hosts — or in theater — for all hosts of reasons, you know. It’s a lot of time, and it’s a lot of effort to bring life to this thing that exists temporarily and then is gone, you know, and just exists in people’s hearts and minds.

David McNally
You’re very isolated as a, for me I was, you know, more episodic. I would come in as a guest star, or guest lead or principle or something on different shows. You’re flown in, you’re driven to your hotel, you’re driven to set, you meet your wardrobe and your makeup, you might get a chance to meet some of the other actors on that day, you might get a chance to read the script — may not, most often not — with the other cast members before you go to set, you arrive to set, there’s a brief rehearsal after you go through the rigmarole of getting prepared, and then you’re shooting. And then it’s done. It’s in the can. See ya. You’re back to your hotel, you’re off flying back. So that isolated world, where you’re separated from your community, and engaged into a new collaboration where people know each other, and you’re trying to do it right for them, because it’s their baby, and you’re just kind of an invited guest. I find that really challenging. And it can be demanding on family, of course, because those months in hotels and stuff like that, when you’re doing films are, they really tear out your heart because, for me, I hated being on the phone to my kids and wife, you know. I just, that was the one thing I just didn’t want to do that no more. But I enjoyed the craft so much and I wanted to keep growing as an actor. So it was just, you know, balancing that throughout my life that has allowed me to have the success that I do.

David Read
That’s great that you recognize it. And you got to, you know, do some… let me get into it. Cor-ai, as far as I’m concerned, is one of the greatest hours of science fiction, period.

David McNally
Thank you.

David Read
And it is all about the performances on the screen. This was the back half of the first season of Stargate SG-1, I don’t believe the show had aired yet. And you are figuring this thing out. Tell us about how you got Hanno.

David McNally
That’s interesting. How did it happen? I think I, oh yes. I had done an Outer Limits. And I ended up doing four Outer Limits over the years. But I had done an Outer Limits, and I think that MGM had seen me in that, some of the producers, and so it got me a crack at Hanno. So I would usually drive to Vancouver, as opposed to fly, just to save a little money, so it’s that 13-hour drive from Edmonton. Get through the mountains, straight to the audition and it just worked out really well. And I really enjoyed Mario Azzopardi, was the director I believe, and he kind of took to me. And in fact, he brought me over from SG to do another Outer Limits right after it, so I went one to the other on that one. And coming into it, I made tea, which is — you know, I’m half Korean, half Scottish-Irish — and so for me it felt like it was very communal, like it was about this small community that’s trying to survive against tyranny, you know, oppression, and so I think I kind of took to it that way. And then just the confidence I had from being a stage actor, I think that helped me just to step in amongst the greats that I was working with, and feel confident to give a performance. I feel like, you know, I learned a lot in that experience too. And because just with television and film, you have to pull back so much, you know, like, the frame is only so big. And as a stage actor, I’m used to, you know, the size and all that stuff. So just that sort of reeling in the craft and allowing it to happen inside and not worrying so much about pushing it out, because the camera’s coming to find you. So that’s kind of the story behind that one. And in terms of how I got it, you know, always audition.

David Read
How did you read… it’s the rare person among us who have had to face the killer of a family member. You know, on top of someone that the audience recognizes as an ally. Was that tricky?

David McNally
You know, I think it’s because of the, again, the experiences and the amount of reading I do, you know, I spend a lot of time reading and just immersing myself into great novels. And you get, again, that emotional connection when you you identify with a character, or a hero in some way. And it just, you know, kind of breathing it in, right, to imagine that someone’s killed your father, and you were a child. And that imagination, and then allowing yourself just to feel it and not worrying about whether or not you’re portraying it real, you know, realistically. Because it is real, and everyone’s reactions are different to that type of tragedy. So, go with the feeling that you have, and allow yourself to believe that it’s going to work, you know, without doubting yourself in the journey. I think also just the fact that those actors were so welcoming. You know, that was a place that was easy to walk into, and a really comfortable way of working on the set of Stargate. It wasn’t, you know, someone with a stopwatch trying to push through scenes, “Oh, we got it!” You know, no, it was like, “OK, let’s do it right. Let’s take our time. Let’s let’s figure it out.” And there’s humor always happening between every take, which keeps everyone light and enjoying it.

David Read
You have to have levity. Considering the material that you’re dealing with here, you know, it would be just a mess to get through it. Tell us about those courtroom scenes. You’re working the opposition with the different guys.

David McNally
You know, with that one, I really enjoyed that. Because usually my television experiences up until then were, you know, like short scenes, quick dialogue, not a lot of monologue opportunity where you get to take a run at something for a while. And of course, being a stage actor that was my preference. And so when I got a chance to get into a courtroom, it felt very much like a stage. And to be able to run for a while, to kind of just allow the thoughts to come. And to really have a specific intention in terms of, “I want this man dead, I want this to fall dead. He’s destroyed my life.” And so staying focused on my intent, having the opportunity to feel as if I was playing a room, which is so cool. And just the sort of stillness of everyone else within that courtroom, allowed my mobility and energy to really zoom in on Christopher for that scene. And for me, I just, I loved it. It was great.

David Read
The script is such a tightrope walk, because you could have a kid — well a young man, an adult — who’s close minded, and says that based on his legal system, “I don’t care what y’all want. I want his head. And that’s all.” And I go back and I watched the episode — we just rewatched it on Wormhole X-Tremists — and I think part of it is, “OK. Look at these people’s hardware, look at where they’re coming from, we have to play it a little bit safer with them, because where they come, many may come after.” And I think that that partly plays into his decision, but also even considering everything that he’s gone through. I think part of it is the passage of time. He’s more reasonable, at least to listen. And the Cor-ai allows, at the very least, a platform for him to listen and hear about the triumphs of this man, since he has turned from his false god. And, you know, balancing that performance — most of this comes down to the script — but balancing that performance as an actor, you know, has to be pretty tricky because you’re trying to make sure that the performance is as authentic as possible without coming off as disingenuous.

David McNally
Yeah, and I think the character, Hanno, really wanted to just kill him right off. But there were principles or, you know, a foundation in that society that wants to grow right. It didn’t want to become a mayhem of, you know, strength as the ruling force. It wants to be a society where it has those laws that everyone adheres to, and that’s what’s going to make us a better society. And so he was really convinced by those around him to restrain and to pull back. And also, I think Hanno was a leader within that society. So he had to set an example that was correct in terms of his position in that community. And so following through on the Cor-ai was the right thing to do. And I think he felt confident he was going to win, especially with the way that Christopher played Teal’c, in that he was just ready to accept his punishment.

David Read
“This case represents the many.” And then Rick says, well Jack says, “It should not.” The dichotomy of those two warriors, both of them, depending on your view, guilty of God knows what in service to their governments, their countries. The moral tightrope walk at play, is delicious. And I think really, as an audience member going back and watching it, this is one of the first ones that you could really see that they’re sinking their teeth into, and we’re just kind of like, on the edge of our seats saying you know, “This kind of applies, this applies to both of them.” You know. And Jack is arguing, you know, for himself as much as for Teal’c, when you really look beneath the surface.

David McNally
Yeah, he’s going to transgress the law of this society that he’s walked into, and also his own society. If he just rushes in and takes him away, or creates conflict with this community, he’s taking us backwards in terms of what law can bring to a society. True justice, you know, how do we get true justice? And of course, it poses all kinds of other questions, like, because somebody did something in the past, should they, you know, feel punishment for that. Something that happened, whatever, 20 years ago, 30 years ago, should they be responsible for that in the present?

David Read
Absolutely. Of course, you know, and sci fi is the best… because it’s all these genres. You can tell these stories, you know, Nuremberg level questions, and get away with it in science fiction because it puts a fair amount of distance between us and the subject matter, so that we can take it all in as an audience member and go, “OK, based on this set of circumstances, were I placed in this situation, how would I do any better?”

David McNally
And people change, right? People change, people go through change, and what… I mean, I think back to myself as a foolish teenager, you know, I am so happy… I mean, those experiences, I regret to think about them, but now I know that they were a learning experience to make me wiser, and to guide me into making better decisions as I went forward. And then there’s the responsibility of being a warrior, being a soldier, and what you’re asked to do, and how you weigh that with your conscience, you know, can you do that? But I guess once you sign up as a soldier, that’s your job. And you’re gonna be asked to do things that you don’t want to do, in your conscience, but you end up doing, and then you have to live with those things. And that’s huge, you know. And I imagine the military people that follow Stargate really saw that within the themes of the show. Because they know they could be asked at any point to drop a bomb on someone, or to do, you know, something atrocious that they would never want done to their own family. But it’s their responsibility.

David Read
That they live with forever.

David McNally
Yeah. So those themes are so strong. Those are powerful themes for, you know, a 47-minute sci fi [show]. That’s huge.

David Read
Absolutely. My only issue with the episode, and they hang a lantern on it earlier on, you know, “We’re overdue for a visit.” Is the timing… you have to buy it, you know, is the timing of the arrival of the opportunity for Teal’c to redeem himself. And Hanno has to see that change, he has to witness it himself to understand what journey of transformation this particular Jaffa has been on since last seeing him.

David McNally
Yeah, that’s true. And you know, the Stargate… I think that we just, like you say, you have to be open to whatever can come through there, at any time. And that’s part of buying into the show and what it’s all about. And I mean, coincidence does happen. Serendipity does happen. Things do happen in life. So why can’t we buy it in science fiction?

David Read
Absolutely. Absolutely. The scene at the episode, at the end, even Teal’c is like, “I am the one.” and I was like, “Ehhh.” “I think you’ve slayed that man.” is a great scene. And it works. You know, I think that the pieces were set up properly, so that we can go back and as an audience and say, “Yeah, yeah. Teal’c has had an opportunity to really show his quality,” if I’m going to borrow from Tolkien in this episode, and we as an audience, we buy that, yes, this is an excuse for him to be redeemed, but will Hanno buy it. And I think it works.

David McNally
Yeah. And the other Stargate members also… they know that Teal’c has come through his past, and so that they’re confident of that, and they’re making every effort to save him, but at the same time, they have to weigh that question of, “Well, what about what he did?” You know, what he’s done in the past. And can they continue to love him knowing that he’s murdered so many people, which may not have been as evident to them up until this point, that he has this dark past.

David Read
Did you see The Ark of Truth, the DVD movie that came after the series?

David McNally
I saw some of it, sorry, I don’t remember it clearly.

David Read
I’m going to send you a scene later on today, at some point, that he has a conversation with another person who is in a very similar situation as him. And it’s mostly just a monologue of Teal’c saying that, you know, “You’ve you’ve done terrible things. And at the same time, that even though you can never forgive yourself, you must seek out justice for those who cannot seek it out for themselves.” It calls back to Cor-ai. And it says, you know, that his journey toward seeking redemption will never be complete, but that every single act builds on overcoming what he was before.

David McNally
Yeah. And we all have to do that, you know, at some point, in the time that we have.

David Read
It wasn’t a year later, you came back as Simon in an episode Demons. And this was a very different kind of character with a very different… there was still Goa’uld oppression there, but there was also an internal oppression in this particular society. What do you remember about Simon?

David McNally
Well, yeah. I liked the fact that he was different than Hanno. I liked the fact that he was on the other end of the spectrum in terms of bravery. His weakness and trying to do things in a spiritual fashion and, you know, trying to really protect the innocent, but not having the strength or courage to do anything about it. That was an interesting one in terms of my journey in getting the role, is that I did the drive to Vancouver, all night, in the winter, and I got there. I arrived at a friend’s place at about three, four in the morning. And I went in, I had my bike, I had a bunch of stuff because I was going to stay there for a while. I was hoping to do some auditions in Vancouver. I went into my friend and I said, “Do you think my bike’s OK back out there in my van? Should I bring it in or lock it up?” He said “Yeah, it’s not really a great neighborhood.” I went outside my van was gone. Everything was gone, that I had. I was in my socks, I have t-shirt, jeans, and I had the sides for the audition for Stargate in my pocket, fortunately, because my audition was at nine o’clock that morning. So I went in, I borrowed some boots and a coat from my friend and I went into this audition but my mind was just like, “All my stuff is gone. All my clothes, like tools…”

David Read
Your car.

David McNally
It was a van, yeah. Full of stuff. I was planning on staying there for a month. And so I think Peter DeLuise saw the desperation. And he wanted that type of energy within the character, so I think it really helped. And then he said, “Oh, will you cut your hair?” you know, and of course I do like my hair, so I said, “Sure.” And I let them, you know, and when I got the role I was so excited, because it was really something… I needed a break after that. And they shaved my hair, and I kept one strand, you never really see it in the shot.

David Read
Oh, really?

David McNally
Yeah. But Peter was great, and he really kept me relaxed through the experience and I just, I enjoyed it. You know, I do a lot of studying in theology. So I always like to learn a little bit more about, you know, spirituality and Christianity and things like that. I’m just fascinated by it.

David Read
It’s where we come from. I mean, there’s a religious background to all of us, you know, you go far back enough.

David McNally
Yeah. And of course, it has that medieval feeling too, you know, which is the Dark Ages and all that. So, the set was fantastic. You know, they really built that whole town there. It was just a great place to work. And of course, we were also working within the forest areas of North Van, and I really enjoyed that experience. And of course coming back to the Stargate family there, and being so welcomed there it was excellent.

David Read
DeLuise, that was his second season working on the show. Just one of my favorite people, period. That particular episode was the second time we had seen an Unas before, so that was kind of cool. And I can’t imagine what it was like for that guy under that suit with the makeup and everything else. What was it like dealing with… Did you have any issues dealing with the environment and out of doors? I meant to ask you this on Cor-ai as well, of being up in the mountain and in the forested area there? Were there any days that just shut production down?

David McNally
No, we were really lucky there. I’ve had that happen on Outer Limits. Experiences where suddenly the rain comes and, you know, you can shoot to a certain amount in the rain, but after a while, it’s just, you lose it, it just becomes all grain across your screen and sound gets really bad and so forth. But no, that worked out really well. It was all beautiful weather. I enjoyed just the transition and the arc of Simon. Going from a character that’s so afraid, so, so oppressed, and finding those steps with the team to find some courage to be a part of change, you know. Again, in some ways, you know, freeing the team and being a part of that. Freeing the society from tyranny. That seemed to be a theme that carried over from Hanno in some way.

David Read
He had a much more active participant in the transformation, in this change as well. Laura Mennell played Mary, and she was someone who Simon had agreed, at least a year before to assist with, or at least to help watch after, you know. And she is, when we come upon the village, she has been selected because of, I think she had chickenpox if I’m not mistaken, to be taken by this thing, you know. And he’s got to do something to stop it. And then we’ve got SG-1 to come in and help, you know, shift things around a little bit.

David McNally
Medieval days when, you know, when they would identify a witch.

David Read
Correct.

David McNally
This society would [say], “Oh, let’s get rid of her.”

David Read
Right, exactly. But I love this episode because it shows those shades of grey where even when you have an evil person, like Canon doing evil things, when the chips are down, you look to Simon and the Unas is coming after them, and Simon’s still protecting his leader. Despite the… he’s physically standing between the Unas and his leader, despite whatever this guy has done to him or his family or the people he has loved in the past. You can’t deny the heroism of this guy. It’s truly defined right then and there. You know, when the chips are down, he rises to the occasion.

David McNally
Yeah. And learned, it’s a learned thing because he sees in the Stargate team, that courage and their understanding of what his society is, starts to dawn on him a little bit more. I don’t think he loses his faith, you know, which is why he would protect his leader because it’s so intrinsic. You know, and in a dark world, what else do you hang on to? You know, you really need something that says to you, “OK, there’s better life beyond this horrid experience that I’m having.” And so you attach yourself to that faith, and it’s that faith that gets you through those times that are tragic, or horrific. And so, Simon had that, at least, you know, as a basis for his bravery, that if he is willing to step into the realm of danger, he’s taken care of spiritually.

David Read
Well, it’s one of my personal — as a Christian — it’s one of my personal favorite moments of the show, when the Unas says, “Your God has abandoned you.” And he stands tall and said, “My God is with me always.” And you know, in his heart of hearts, he’s spiritually a rock, no matter what happens to him in the physical. It’s one of my favorite moments of the series, you know. Someone who is truly exercising all the best parts of himself to save the people that he loves, in an unjust situation.

David McNally
And you’re right, it’s interesting [what] the themes are. You see the imprisonment in Cor-ai, and then you see the imprisonment in Demons as well. And so that, finding… getting a freedom, finding freedom and then there’s the larger metaphor of us being imprisoned here on the planet, you know, and how the Gate is a way out as a way to go beyond what we feel restrained to. I thought that was kind of interesting that, you know, both those episodes had that element in there.

David Read
And it’s interesting, though, that their escape from it is to bury the Gate in this particular situation, rather than to go to another planet and get in trouble. So, there’s a lot of those elements there. You came back several seasons later, and on a completely different version of the franchise for Atlantis, as Avrid, in I believe it was, was it season two? It was season two, it was season two, and a lot of work with with Joe Flanigan in this episode. Tell us about that experience.

David McNally
You know, I really enjoyed coming back. Always, like, you know, to come back into work with people that I’m familiar with. So the crew was… there was a lot of crossover crew. Martin Wood I had known from Edmonton. He was here, in a series, I think it was Jake and the Kid where I’d met him and he was a director way back when. I was in a season of that. And so he was around, and then the producers were around. So it was that kind of familiarity. Working outdoors I really liked. And again, I would say a spiritual character which, “OK, this is great.” You know, they saw something in me that they liked in terms of that quality that they thought would be right for the character of Avrid. Again, he starts off, you know, kind of afraid, reluctant to engage in stopping the tyranny that they’re suffering. And yet, again carrying a spiritual nature of, you know, peace is the way, against the violence, and eventually finding the courage again. So that quality was there. Great cast, you know, Joe was just, again, just… you don’t always get this, David, where you go on a show and the main cast is so open and warm, and you know, relaxed and really encouraging. It doesn’t happen all the time. Usually, people are so worried about success, that they miss the opportunity to engage with the people that come in and out of the show, and really get to know them or allow — help them — to feel more comfortable in their world that they have to go through every day, long hours and so on. So Joe was one of those great guys who just, he’s absolutely like that. From my memory was he was just totally welcoming and really easy to work with.

David Read
You can definitely see the different time of year in this episode, in terms of the season in Vancouver and when it was shot, because it’s all sunny and gorgeous, and everyone’s in, you know, there’s not a lot of mud on the ground. And I think it really lent itself to the beauty of this sanctuary field that they were inside of as well, and you guys got to spend, if I’m not mistaken, pretty much all of that production on location.

David McNally
Pretty much, yeah. Yeah, even the interiors were there, they were there.

David Read
Yeah. And I love that it’s a similar — the episode’s called Epiphany, by the by. I haven’t brought that up — that there is a similar arc there, where the community, in this particular situation, has to overcome a shared threat that is keeping them from finding their true path and rejoining the rest of their kind.

David McNally
Yes, and in Joe, the character was there to help them do that, right? And they recognized that. That he was the one that was going to help them get to the ascension that they were moving towards. And the reason they were in the sanctuary was to ascend. So yeah, it’s, again, a similar theme, and I think the writers are drawing from so much of our history in that way. The show itself, like Stargate is — one of my fascinations with it — is it’s the historical aspects of it, that they’re finding, you know, archaeology and things that guide them forward. And so, here’s a realm that’s been isolated from the rest of the universe, and that isolation, in itself is the barrier to their ascension. They need the fear of outside, what’s outside, in a way creates that monster, that invisible powerful oppressor that’s there. And, yeah, I think those are really strong themes that we need to get beyond nationhood, in some way, or even, you know, where our neighborhood is the only thing. We have to know that it’s our interaction with others that makes us better as a whole.

David Read
Looking at these three episodes, it really does show how threats can come from abroad, but also help comes from abroad as well. And you have to be, well in this third episode of the situation, they’re literally self-contained, no one could really come in easily. But you know, always be open to the possibility of new knowledge and new information and new experiences from others. It’s not always just going to be, you know, “Oh, this person is only a threat.” You know, I think that these episodes really share in the potential of learning and growing, like you said, from others from beyond our borders.

David McNally
Yeah, and our own philosophies, you know, like, we have to at least open our mind enough to hear the different perspectives. And then that can carry us forward, because we weigh it against our own beliefs, and realize that there are some commonalities. And that’s what we should enjoin ourselves to, in order to make a better world and a better experience, for all, as opposed to just myself. “I’m OK, I don’t need to mix with anybody else.” Well…

David Read
What are you missing?

David McNally
Yeah, what comes in makes you better, you know?

David Read
That’s right. You know, and Sheppard, when he first shows up, they have the montages of time passing. You don’t want to sit there and meditate, you know, because he’s a warrior. This is not what he does. He’d much rather be, you know, running and gunning. But he also takes from them as well, and I think finds a degree of inner peace that he didn’t before.

David McNally
You see that in the show, he starts to… he goes from being really bored with whole thing, and then he starts to just, kind of, allow it to happen to him. You know, I’d love to see that kind of arc continue for him, if he can go down that path where he just becomes a more of a spiritual leader in some way.

David Read
But it indicates that, you know, we are capable of those things if we… of things that we don’t think that we can do if we quiet our minds and listen to ourselves a little bit more. If I take anything away from Epiphany, it’s to slow down and listen to your inner voices a little bit more, and filter out some of the noise in the world, and also be receptive to those who are trying to tell you something.

David McNally
Yeah. Isn’t it great how, you know, just television shows can kind of bring that into your contemplation?

David Read
Absolutely. I think Stargate, specifically, you can, on the surface just watch it as an action — particularly Atlantis — as an action show. Or there is philosophy to pull from it, if you so choose. Like Star Wars, you know, it’s very, very similar in that way.

David McNally
Yeah. And each show has themes that they want to explore, they want the audiences to think about and to take away and bring into their own lives. And that is an enrichment, and that’s what brings us back to those shows, when we are being enriched by them. If it is just all action, OK that’s entertainment, but you’re not thinking about that beyond the show. When it has something that it wants to say and it struggles with, whether it’s a theme that is, you know, controversial, then it’s creating that thought in everybody and every viewer. And they toss it around and the people within their lives, and so are broadened by doing so.

David Read
Absolutely. I’ve got some fan questions for you. Are we good on time?

David McNally
Oh, I’m good. Yeah.

David Read
OK. Lockwatcher, you landed roles in both SG-1 and Atlantis. Were there any differences in working between the two casts?

David McNally
The only difficulty for me there was that I didn’t get to work with other cast members outside of Joe. All my interaction was [with] him, except for one scene where they come in, and there’s the combative against the beast. I think that with the Stargate, that first season, they were really getting to know it themselves. And you could see that they were trying to figure out their characters and their relationships with each other and the crew. And I came in as a guest on that. And I was really welcomed by everyone, but I could tell that it was a beginning. And no one really knew where it was gonna go. The next time that I came in, it was really established. They were who they were. And I also came back, I brought some of my college students — I was teaching college at one point for a couple of years, a Motion Picture Arts program — and I brought eight of my students into Vancouver to introduce them to agents in the community. Called up Stargate, they said, “Oh, bring them all down!” So I was able to bring all my students down and they got to meet them and wander around set.

David Read
It was during Atlantis?

David McNally
During SG-1. So that was just so great. Coming back years later to do Atlantis, I didn’t know what to expect, but it had a very similar feel in terms of that first year of Stargate where they were getting to know each other and who their characters are. And they were starting to get a rhythm, you know, you could see that that rhythm was happening, that it becomes like a machine, you know, a well oiled machine. They know exactly what to do on a day-to-day basis, and the stress just kind of disappears, which makes the craft better.

David Read
Correct. Spydermag wanted to know, is there an actor that you’ve worked with that inspired you to really sharpen your craft?

David McNally
Peter Donat. I don’t know if you know Peter Donat. I worked with him in a production of Man for all Seasons here at the Citadel theater. I played the Common Man, and he was Sir Thomas Moore. And I watched everything he did. From first day rehearsal, to the final performance. I would sit in the [inaudible] of a thrust stage, and when he was on stage, and I wasn’t, I was watching him. I was riveted to his work. And what I found was that, everything was fresh, every time. There was no, “I’m going to do it like I did it before.” He was listening so well, and just naturally in the moment, without any artifice attached to his performance. I was smitten by it. So he’s the one guy in terms of the craft of acting and theatre that I really was amazed by. I got to work with John Vernon, if you remember John Vernon, the Dean from American Graffiti. And we did an independent film together and he was so intense in his work. Everything had to be right. I remember, you know, the first reading I did with him, they were trying to put a certain costumes, test a costume on him. And he rejected that costume completely because he really felt he knew this guy. And it became combative with the wardrobe head, and that wardrobe head was fired as a result.

David Read
Wow.

David McNally
I was like, “Wow, this guy is… he’s bent on knowing who he is. And he wants to stay with that.” He was a gentleman in the work process, but once that camera rolled, there was a click, and I enjoyed that experience a lot just to see how that man worked. And he had done so much television by that point. So he was another guy that I attached my eyes to, and watching and listening and trying to pick up as much as I could.

David Read
I don’t know, I mean, to have that kind of have control over, “Oh, I would not wear that as that person.”

David McNally
Why would you argue?

David Read
Yeah.

David McNally
Don’t argue with him. He’s the lead!

David Read
Yeah. That’s the thing. That’s what it comes down to, I suppose. Rick Doner, what theater techniques do you think helped you translate to television and film?

David McNally
You know, one of the things that I kept hearing [was] that props and costumes, and, you know, just camera, what everybody appreciated was the type of discipline that I brought. And I really picked that up in training as a stage actor. You know, there’s no room for error when you’re walking out on a stage that is live and the audience is there. So your preparation is so important. And then the respect of the craft, so you know, how you hang up your costumes at the end of the day, and how you take care of things, how you protect your costume, how you protect your props, and all the work that they’re doing for you, to help you perform. I never neglected that. And I think that discipline came from the theater. And I continually apply it and it’s a sign of respect for everyone that’s working on it in a collaborative forum. I think that sometimes actors bypass that and they get to where there’s an ego, and maybe it’s part of trying to hang on to a confidence, but they somehow treat the crew as less. They’re all knowing and the crew, well, the crews looking at you, they’re the eyes, they’re the ones that see that your hair is out of place, or that your costume is not right, or whatever it might be, or your words aren’t perfect and things like that. So just respect for them is something that I really think translated well from the theater into the craft of film and television. Though they are two different beasts, you know. The thing of what I was saying earlier about, just bring it back, just bring it back. When I was so, so trained to be large.

David Read
Right, they’re out there in the crowd, you know. They’re not right up here in a lens.

David McNally
Not looking at your eyelash. So that reeling it in is something that you’re not going to get from the theater, but the theater will give you the confidence to adapt, to change, to know that it’s okay to do that. Because if you’ve gone through doing large roles or any role on a stage in front of a large audience, live every time, you gain a real grounded sense of your ability, and the ability to change it, you know, to manipulate it and turn it into [inaudible].

David McNally
Just from one take to another. Have you ever asked for another take to be done? To try it a different way?

David McNally
Oh, yeah, I have yeah, sometimes. I just felt I didn’t do it, you know, didn’t find the emotion that was correct for that particular one — a reaction. You know, sometimes it’s what’s going on in your own life that kind of gets in the way, in some way. So you can easily be distracted. Sometimes things are broken up. So I was doing one movie and it was a very emotional scene and the director cut halfway through this take, because they wanted a different angle on it or something, and then I was like, “I have to start from the beginning in order to make that happen.” I can’t just, you know, “Cut now, bring it up there.” You need some emotional flow to that. So I have asked, not often. I like to hand it over to them and their eyes. It’s particularly the director who has all the knowledge as to what the end result should be.

David Read
Yeah, but you have to work to that end result.

David McNally
So I’m going to trust that.

David Read
Right? Like, “Hey buddy, if this sucks starting from B instead of A, you’ll know why.”

David McNally
Yeah. Your name’s on it too.

David Read
That’s right, exactly. PacManD3, I think we kind of answered that one, but maybe not necessarily, what you think the biggest difference in challenges between acting on stage and then TV or film.

David McNally
And also, you know, to add a little bit more, vocal quality, you know. You don’t see it so much today. And for me, as a theater-trained actor, I’m often frustrated when I’m watching television, and particularly film, “[quiet and unintelligible words].” And I’m going, “What? What did you say? Those words are important, I want to hear.” But because that mic is hidden right here, or whatever it is, you know, or the boom is just above them, there’s no pushing it. It’s just all in check. And I think that’s a really good thing to apply when you’re doing television and film. It’s just, it’ll stop you from being too big. It’ll stop you from putting, you know, too much on this small screen. Pull it all in.

David Read
Pull it all back.

David McNally
Yeah.

David Read
Melissa Smith, is [there] any special moment in your career that still sticks out, and has encouraged you?

David McNally
Encouragement, you know, encouragement comes often from the people around you that have said, “Hey, that was great, thank you. I really enjoyed that.” Or, “I was touched by that.” Most of my accolades that I really hang on to as a person are the ones that I got from my students. Because, you know, I spent a lot of time with them on a daily basis, and so forth. And when I’d get a card at the end of the year, or I’d get a kid come up and say thank you for getting them through a production that they didn’t think they would get through. Those are the things that have moved me forward and made me love the art so much more. In terms of the biz, it’s hard to think right off the top, but I know that there’s been lots of them, where someone has come up and just said, you know, “Hey, I really enjoyed what you just did with that.” And I just take that, and put it in my pocket.

David Read
Absolutely. For a rainy day, when it’s like, “Whoa, I don’t think I did very well today!” You’re going to have bad days, you know. Especially when you’re doing a run of a show where you do 60, 90 iterations of it, outside is going to interfere with inside, you know — I mean, having done it in high school — and you just have to do the best you can to filter it out, you know. Or maybe incorporate it into the intensity of a performance. Try it a little different tonight.

David McNally
You know, myself included, we often are our worst critics, right? So, you know, auditioning is a horrid world. It’s a terrible place to be. Because you don’t get the direction that you need, you know. And as an actor, you take confidence in the idea that you can change, you can, if somebody gives you a note, “OK, I’ll apply that note, or those notes, to this next scene.” But when you’re auditioning, you get no notes. You get a very small little bio as to who the character might be, and your side just might be a scene, or two scenes or something, within a larger story that you’re not privy to. So it’s a real, it’s kind of a guessing game, rolling the dice. You know, do what you think is right and hope that it gets you the chance to perform further. So yeah, it’s a tough world. You criticize yourself all the time, going, “Oh, I could have done that better, I could have done that better.” But then sometimes you overthink it as well. It’s like, you know, “I should have just gone with the first take.” Just let it happen. And then decide whether that’s right or not.

David Read
Well Stephen King talks about, you know, often his first go at a sentence when he’s writing, he says, you know, “You can always go back and you can always rework it. You will always find more words if you need to, to re-examine the sentence that you’ve created. But is it really going to make it that much better?” You know, sometimes your first instincts are your first instincts for a reason.

David McNally
Yeah. And then you overthink, and you add too much to it and becomes too much. Stephen King’s also great in terms of taking away words. We say too much, so often. Just clip, clip. clip, clip, clip, clip, bring it down to its essence.

David Read
That’s exactly right. Yes, second draft equals first draft, minus 10%. That’s one of his things I remember from him. Tracy, are you currently working on any projects you can talk about?

David McNally
Oh, I’m working on a very exciting project I can’t talk about. NDA, you know. So, yeah, I’m really excited. This particular month, I’m doing something far out. So I’ll hold off on that one.

David Read
Well, please email us. I’ll also be keeping an eye on the Googles as well for that one. We’ll definitely share that. And last, but certainly not least, Teresa MC, would you step through the Stargate if given the opportunity?

David McNally
Yes, I would. I used to always go with you know, when we get into those morbid conversations, like, “What are you going to do when you die? Like, are you going to get cremated or buried.” I’ve said, “I always wanted to be shot into space.” So if they had a Stargate, they could just like, shuffle me through there. But yeah, I mean, if there was a Stargate right now, I think I would go. I would, I’m an explorer, I love getting out into the mountains and into the woods, I love canoeing and stuff like that. So I think any adventure is really exciting. I love traveling, my wife and I travel a lot. And we continue to look for opportunities to do more of that. So I would travel through the Gate for sure. You?

David Read
Me?

David McNally
Yeah.

David Read
I think I would, with a written guarantee of survival. Of course, I would. Absolutely. Last question for you, Misadventures of a Little Wolf, what do you do in your downtime? You know, what do you do to free yourself from your…

David McNally
There’s a lot of things I’m doing. I’m retired, so I got a lot of free time right now. One of the things I’m doing is a lot of Duolingo, learning Spanish, reviewing French, and I’m also learning Hebrew. Just for something to do. I’m reading lots. I’ve written a lot of poetry throughout my life. So the problem is, is that it’s all in pencil and in cursive writing, so I’m slowly doing all the typing of it, of my collections of poetry. I do some script writing, just, you know, on the side. I do some supply teaching, I’ll be covering 10 one-acts next week, helping them, a bunch of students get through some one-acts, both in terms of their tech and their performances. So yeah, my days are filled, but you know, the nice thing about being retired is that I can go, “Mmm, no.”

David Read
Exactly right. I was like, “Yeah, this guy sounds like he’s retired. Not.” “I’m retired in that I can say no.” There you go. David, this has been a real pleasure, for me, Sir.

David McNally
A pleasure for me.

David Read
I love having you. And I think your significance to the body of work that is this show is, it’s a big deal to have you. So I really appreciate having you on.

David McNally
Well thank you so much for having me. You know, I wished I would have done more. I enjoyed the experience so much. I’m happy that it’s being celebrated by so many fans. People that were involved in it were just excellent.

David Read
Philippe Canat said, “Yeah, we would have liked to have seen you on Destiny as well, in Stargate Universe.” It’s like, “Yeah.” you know. That show got cut way too short so it’s entirely possible he’s out there floating around.

David McNally
Let’s hope there’s a new one, right?

David Read
Oh, absolutely. Yes, sir. I’m gonna go ahead and wrap this up on my end. I really, really appreciate you joining me today, sir. And all the best to you.

David McNally
My pleasure, and thanks fans.

David Read
Thank you, David. Be well. David McNally with Stargate SG-1 and Atlantis. Thank you so much for tuning in today. A couple of questions for me. I know my volume has been an issue. I am working on that, I just tried a new cable and a new port on the computer. So I apologize, I’m still tweaking that. General Maximus says “Sundays are perfect for me for the show. Just wanted to let you know that if it is a permanent switch, consider making it…” So, Wormhole. X-Tremists is on Sundays and right now we’re going to keep the bulk of the Dial the Gate interviews on Saturdays, unless a guest makes a special request because they can’t make it. We’ve got John de Lancie, Q, coming up on a Wednesday in a couple of weeks from now, a week and a half or so. So keep an eye on the schedule at dialthegate.com for all of those details and if you enjoyed the episode, consider giving us a Like as well. My thanks to my producer, Linda “GateGabber” Furey, as well as my moderating team Summer, Tracy, Jeremy, Rhys and Antony. Antony really stepped up today, we’ve got some power outage problems because of the weather across the Americas, so we’re making it happen for you guys as well. And big thanks to Frederick Marcoux at ConceptsWeb, our web developer who makes the show continue to go. My thanks again to David McNally today for making this episode possible. He is one of my favorite guest stars from SG-1 and Atlantis, so it was really a privilege to have him. Jonathan Glassner is pre-recorded and coming up in just 55 minutes. So he’s going to be talking about the Ark and sharing more memories from Stargate SG-1, as well, the first three seasons. And after him, next week we have, on February the 11th at 12 noon, currently scheduled James Tichenor, Visual Effects Producer and Writer of Stargate SG-1 at 12 noon Pacific Time. And then Anna Galvin at 4pm Pacific Time as well, multiple roles in Stargate SG-1, Atlantis and Universe. She’s one of the few actors that did all three. I may have a two o’clock booking here. I’m trying to get a certain YouTuber on who’s been doing a rewatch of Stargate. So if we get him, we’ll definitely let you all know between here and there. Keep an eye on the social channels and I hope you join us for Wormhole X-Tremists tomorrow, because we’re doing Tin Man and There but for the Grace of God on the Wormhole X-Tremists channel starting at 12 noon Pacific Time. My name is David Read for Dial the Gate. I really appreciate you tuning in, and we will see you on the other side, if I can find my title button.